Old Weather Forum

Posted: **Tue May 04, 2021 7:38 pm**

September 12:

12:00 fired national salute in honor of the one hundredth anniversary of the writing of the "Star Spangled Banner." Expended 21 rounds saluting ammunition, 6-pounder, and received 21 empty six pound cartridge cases.

https://catalog.archives.gov/OpaAPI/med ... 4_0327.JPG

Posted: **Thu May 20, 2021 6:17 pm**

This has been the easiest trip down the Inside Passage. Here is a the navigation entry for the Meridian to 4PM shift on September 17.

Stood down Lama Passage, through Fisher Channel into Fitzhugh Sound where watch ends.

The course column in the weather section just says "Various" for the entire day.

https://catalog.archives.gov/OpaAPI/med ... 4_0334.JPG

Posted: **Thu May 20, 2021 6:28 pm**

I know. Well, I don't know about that specific day, but I've seen lots of those cases before. Hopefully they give bearings off lots of places as they pass by.

Posted: **Thu May 20, 2021 8:59 pm**

Just a few bearings here & there. For the example above, that was the only entry for the entire watch.

Posted: **Sun May 23, 2021 8:56 pm**

I've been doing something with this log that may be confusing for Michael.

This log contains many entries of the form, "Watch ends _____.", where the blank contains a location and/or direction. I've been entering the time as the last hour of the watch rather than the time at the end of the watch. For example, if the watch was 8AM to Meridian, I entered the time as 11AM.

It would be more accurate to show the time in the above example as Meridian, but my thinking was that if I did that it would be unclear as to whether the entry belonged to the 8AM to Meridian watch or to the Meridian to 4PM watch. Showing the time as 11AM makes it clear that the entry belongs to the 8AM to Meridian watch.

Another part of my thinking was that the entry was made at the end of the watch, which is still part of the final hour of the watch and therefore should be entered as data for that final hour rather than the first hour of the next watch.

For the above example, maybe it would be best to enter the time as 11:59AM?

Here is an example page with such an entry at the end of the 8AM to Meridian shift.
https://catalog.archives.gov/OpaAPI/med ... 4_0337.JPG

Posted: **Sun May 23, 2021 11:05 pm**

The distances and courses listed at a given hour are those at the end of that hour. So enter the time for the hour at the end of the watch, i.e. Time -> Noon; type -> Sailing Info; Sub-type ->Course; Data: cc E for

8 AM to Noon Watch ends on course E.

If you enter the time as 11:59 the data goes into the line for hour 11.

It is confusing, and it took me some time to figure out just how they log their courses and distances. Also, sometimes the log-keeper is sloppy and, if they change course at Noon to W, they might enter W for Noon and not 1 PM.

Posted: **Mon May 24, 2021 1:20 am**

Hummmm...

"Watch ends on course E."
I realize that this is just an example, but unless that indicates a course change there's no need to transcribe that is there?

For Gordon's example page would it be Time -> Noon; type -> Sailing Info; Sub-type ->Location; Data: off Entrance Island, Georgia Strait for

8 AM to Noon Watch ends off Entrance Island, Georgia Strait.

?

Posted: **Mon May 24, 2021 8:40 am**

Randi wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 1:20 am Hummmm...

"Watch ends on course E."
I realize that this is just an example, but unless that indicates a course change there's no need to transcribe that is there?

For Gordon's example page would it be Time -> Noon; type -> Sailing Info; Sub-type ->Location; Data: off Entrance Island, Georgia Strait for
8 AM to Noon Watch ends off Entrance Island, Georgia Strait.
?

I would like to know that too - at the moment, I wouldn't transcribe "Watch ends on course E" either if it's not a course change.
Also: When they mention a location, I have always transcribed it under the last hour of the watch, but have not explicitly mentioned "end of watch".

So for Gordon's example page, I would have done Time -> Noon; type -> Sailing Info; Sub-type -> Location

Off Entrance Island, Georgia Strait.

Please let me know if this is OK, or I should change it.

Posted: **Mon May 24, 2021 1:32 pm**

Hi Chris, What you're doing is exactly right! No need to mention courses if there's no change, nor is there a need to enter End of Watch. The end of watch is given by the time Noon,. so there's no need to repeat that in the data line.

Posted: **Mon May 24, 2021 3:26 pm**

Thank you!

Posted: **Mon May 24, 2021 7:05 pm**

OK, I will change to entering as you suggest. I included "Watch ends" in my previous entries to try to make it clear that even though I showed the entry in the previous hour, the actual time was the end of the shift. Will I be demoted?

Posted: **Mon May 24, 2021 7:10 pm**

Two hours extra duty!

Posted: **Mon May 24, 2021 7:23 pm**

The log for September 21 includes this entry.

3:00AM
heard U.S.S. Buffalo trying to get assistance for U.S.R.C. Tahoma which was sending "S.O.S." calls from Lat. 51-57 N, Long 175-02 E. Various ships and stations notified that none seemed close enough to render assistance.

It looks like the Tahoma ended up sinking, but the crew were rescued.
https://www.naval-history.net/OW-US/Tah ... ahoma1.htm

This got me wondering about the name "Tahoma". There are many places and schools in the Seattle area named Tahoma. It turns out it's the Puyallup Indian tribe's name for Mount Rainier.

Posted: **Mon May 24, 2021 7:30 pm**

https://www.history.uscg.mil/Browse-by- ... homa-1909/

And a later one https://www.history.uscg.mil/Browse-by- ... homa-1934/

Posted: **Mon May 24, 2021 9:56 pm**

Posted: **Thu Jun 03, 2021 6:24 pm**

September is complete.

After just a couple days in Seattle, the Manning was ordered to immediately proceed to Unalaska. One of the articles mentioned that when the Tahoma sank it's crew was redeployed to several other ships, including the Manning. So presumably this is why the quick return to Unalaska. Fortunately it is going directly, rather than through the Inside Passage.

For some odd reason they are adjusting the clocks by increments of 16 or 23 minutes at a time.

Posted: **Thu Jun 03, 2021 6:44 pm**

Posted: **Thu Jun 03, 2021 7:23 pm**

The older ships seem to do that.
Kevin mentioned that it keeps the unlucky watch from having a whole hour added to their shift.

Posted: **Thu Jun 03, 2021 9:05 pm**

I've seen 20 minutes adjustments several times, which makes sense, but why such odd amounts as 16 and 23?

For example, over a period of a couple days the adjustments were 16, 23, 23, which adds up to 62. So the total adjustment was not an even hour.

Posted: **Thu Jun 03, 2021 9:27 pm**

OWpedia:

Randi wrote: ↑Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:49 am Time
Ships keep local time wherever they are, so on a voyage the clocks may change daily. When clocks are put back it makes the watch longer, very unpopular as you can imagine, so it was often done in in two stages, once in the first dog watch (4-pm to 6pm) and once in the second, (6-8pm). [dorbel]
AND
Before the days of GPS, the only way to find local time at sea was to shoot the sun, that is to use a sextant to find the moment when the sun is at an angle of 90 degrees to the visible horizon. If either is not visible, you don't know when local noon is and you can't reset your ship clocks. Perhaps in those circumstances you might note an important time in GMT, which you have on your chronometers.
It occurs to me that an exact time of rendezvouz or when to expect a signal might well be given in GMT to avoid confusion, but I don't know that. [dorbel]
AND
A.T.S. - Apparent Time at Ship, S.A.T. - Ship's Apparent Time, MTS - ? -- "Ship's time: the local mean time of the meridian where a ship is located.
"Before 1920, all ships kept local apparent time on the high seas by setting their clocks at night or at the morning sight so that, given the ship's speed and direction, it would be 12 o'clock when the Sun crossed the ship's meridian (12 o'clock = local apparent noon)." http://www.exactspent.com/time_zone.htm" [lollia paolina]
AND
http://forum.oldweather.org/index.php?t ... #msg113831 [HatterJack]

Old Weather Forum

Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

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Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination

Re: Manning (1914) -- Discussion: Questions, Comments and Coordination